From MYPIXEL at aol.com Fri Jan 7 21:25:32 2000 From: MYPIXEL at aol.com (MYPIXEL@aol.com) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:39 2004 Subject: CCD-world:CTE of TI800 again Message-ID: <99.991778bc.25a7ec0c@aol.com> The following was posted to CCD-world: In a message dated 12/21/99 1:50:20 PM EST, vshal@ira.kharkov.ua writes: << Dear Jim, Thanks very much for your reply. My applications are low level. The operating temperature was about -120 deg. We observed quasars at 4000-5000 ADU with the background at 200-400 (gain = 0.9 e/ADU, readout noise = 11 e) in order to search for their variability. **********************jj Yikes .. .. -120 C not good for virtual phase (based on our experience with them). The warmer the better because of spurious potential traps (kT allows signal charge to escape). Warm the sensor up ! ************************jj So far as we have several images of the same field with some shifts I could separate the background and remove it. Such procedure drastically reduces the background dispersion but the star tails extended along the columns are still seen and they disappoint me very much. Do we really unable to correct them? ************************jj I'm afraid not .. . it's like defocusing the image. Again . . . try increasing the operating temperature up to where dark current becomes a problem. Why are you so cold? ***************************jj I wonder if this effect is permanent and where can I read about its details? SPIE and "Optical Engineering" are not readily available for use here ... ***************************jj I can send you a paper on spurious potential pockets (traps). Again the main complaint for virtual phase technology is this problem. Multi-phase CCDs are better suited for your application I would think. By the way, two phase CCDs often show the problem too. Whenever implants are used to define potential wells. . . . watch out. Good luck and happy new year. . . **************************jj Vyacheslav >> - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From conroy at mso.anu.edu.au Mon Jan 10 23:52:23 2000 From: conroy at mso.anu.edu.au (Peter Conroy) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:39 2004 Subject: CCD-world: 1x1K Chip Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.20000110225223.009529f0@mso.anu.edu.au> The following was posted to CCD-world: Tim Could this request find it's way to to CCD world.? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Dear CCD World. We are seeeking to purchase a THINNED 1K x 1K x 15 micron pixel scientific CCD for use in a a fibre fed spectrograph. The chip is mounted at the focus a small Schmidt camera and needs to have the smallest posible package to avoid unacceptable vignetting of the camera beam. All of the current commercial 1K x 15 micron chips that I have data sheets for are 1x2K frame transfer (1x1K active) chips and this would deliver unacceptabe vignretting. Is there a supplier out there or a group with suitable chips in stock that could fill this requirement ? Regards --------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------------------------------- Peter Conroy - Senior Draftsman - Design Office Mt Stromlo Observatory - Canberra Australia Private Bag Weston Creek PO ACT 2611 Australia Email - conroy@mso.anu.edu.au Phone - 61 02 6279 8022 Fax - 61 02 6249 0233 http://www.mso.anu.edu.au/~conroy -------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From gach at mozart.cnrs-mrs.fr Mon Jan 10 14:47:21 2000 From: gach at mozart.cnrs-mrs.fr (Jean-Luc Gach) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:39 2004 Subject: CCD-world: 1x1K Chip In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.32.20000110225223.009529f0@mso.anu.edu.au> Message-ID: The following was posted to CCD-world: On Mon, 10 Jan 2000, Peter Conroy wrote: > The following was posted to CCD-world: > > Tim > > Could this request find it's way to to CCD world.? > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > Dear CCD World. > > We are seeeking to purchase a THINNED 1K x 1K x 15 micron pixel scientific > CCD for use in a a fibre fed spectrograph. The chip is mounted at the focus > a small Schmidt camera and needs to have the smallest posible package to > avoid unacceptable vignetting of the camera beam. > > All of the current commercial 1K x 15 micron chips that I have data sheets > for are 1x2K frame transfer (1x1K active) chips and this would deliver > unacceptabe vignretting. Is there a supplier out there or a group with > suitable chips in stock that could fill this requirement ? > > Regards > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > Peter Conroy - Senior Draftsman - Design Office > Mt Stromlo Observatory - Canberra Australia > Private Bag Weston Creek PO ACT 2611 Australia > Email - conroy@mso.anu.edu.au > Phone - 61 02 6279 8022 Fax - 61 02 6249 0233 > http://www.mso.anu.edu.au/~conroy > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > - -- CCD-world -- -- > CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk > Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. > For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ > Why don't you de-center the 1kx2k chip so that the active area (unmasked) is not in the vigneted section of the focal plane ?? best regards ------------------------------ GACH Jean-Luc Observatoire de Marseille 2, Place Le Verrier 13248 MARSEILLE cedex 4 FRANCE tel: (+33) 4 95 04 4119 fax: (+33) 4 91 62 1190 - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From Paul.Jorden at eev.com Mon Jan 10 13:41:21 2000 From: Paul.Jorden at eev.com (Paul.Jorden@eev.com) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:40 2004 Subject: CCD-world: 1x1K Chip Message-ID: The following was posted to CCD-world: Peter, > We are seeeking to purchase a THINNED 1K x 1K x 15 micron pixel scientific > CCD for use in a a fibre fed spectrograph. The chip is mounted at the > focus > a small Schmidt camera and needs to have the smallest posible package to > avoid unacceptable vignetting of the camera beam. > > All of the current commercial 1K x 15 micron chips that I have data sheets > for are 1x2K frame transfer (1x1K active) chips and this would deliver > unacceptabe vignretting. Is there a supplier out there or a group with > suitable chips in stock that could fill this requirement ? > Look at our web site and you will see details of the CCD47-10. [The data sheet on the www is for the frontside version however] This is 1k*1k, 13 um pixels, available thinned, AIMO (MPP) or non-IMO. However, the standard ceramic package is probably too large for your application- but certainly a chip with the required full-frame format exists. Let me know if you're interested; we could discuss re-packaging, although there would be NRE costs involved. Does anyone else want the same thing? Best Wishes for the New Year to yourself & all ccd-worlders, Paul _______________________________________________________________ Please note change of name from 'EEV' to 'Marconi Applied Technologies'. _______________________________________________________________ Dr Paul Jorden, CCD Sensors, Marconi Applied Technologies Waterhouse Lane, Chelmsford, Essex, CM1 2QU, UK Tel: 44 (0) 1245 -453458 (direct), -493493 (switchboard) Fax: 44 (0) 1245 453224 http://www.marconi-technologies.co.uk/products/ccd/ccdprod.html - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From Peter.Pool at eev.com Mon Jan 10 16:12:58 2000 From: Peter.Pool at eev.com (Peter.Pool@eev.com) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:40 2004 Subject: CCD-world: 1x1K Chip Message-ID: [[ 47-10B.DOC : 3914 in 47-10B.DOC ]][[ 47-10B.WPD : 3915 in 47-10B.WPD ]] Hi Peter, The attached short form data sheets (in Word & Wordperfect ) are for CCD47-10. This device is 1k x 1k, 13?m pixels, back illuminated. low noise outputs. Would this do the job for you? I was about to send this when I noticed that Paul had already done so, but I shall send it anyway. As he observes, the current standard package is very large. However, a more compact package (about 23 x 30 mm) has been designed and will be available in a few months. If this is still not small enough, I refer you back to Paul's note. Peter Pool CCD Chief Engineer Marconi Applied Technologies (previously known as EEV) ---------- From: conroy@mso.anu.edu.au To: CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Subject: CCD-world: 1x1K Chip Date: 10 January 2000 12:06 <> The following was posted to CCD-world: Tim Could this request find it's way to to CCD world.? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Dear CCD World. We are seeeking to purchase a THINNED 1K x 1K x 15 micron pixel scientific CCD for use in a a fibre fed spectrograph. The chip is mounted at the focus a small Schmidt camera and needs to have the smallest posible package to avoid unacceptable vignetting of the camera beam. All of the current commercial 1K x 15 micron chips that I have data sheets for are 1x2K frame transfer (1x1K active) chips and this would deliver unacceptabe vignretting. Is there a supplier out there or a group with suitable chips in stock that could fill this requirement ? Regards --------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------------------------------- Peter Conroy - Senior Draftsman - Design Office Mt Stromlo Observatory - Canberra Australia Private Bag Weston Creek PO ACT 2611 Australia Email - conroy@mso.anu.edu.au Phone - 61 02 6279 8022 Fax - 61 02 6249 0233 http://www.mso.anu.edu.au/~conroy -------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/msword Size: 36352 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.ctio.noao.edu/pipermail/ccd-world/attachments/20000110/e4b9f8b3/attachment.dot -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/x-wpwin Size: 21065 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.ctio.noao.edu/pipermail/ccd-world/attachments/20000110/e4b9f8b3/attachment.bin From bgoodin at unex.ucla.edu Thu Jan 13 15:33:54 2000 From: bgoodin at unex.ucla.edu (Goodin, Bill) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:40 2004 Subject: CCD-world: UCLA spring short course on CCD/CMOS Imaging Sensors Message-ID: <86A3B318912ED311BCE500A0C960C70601A64455@www3.unex.ucla.edu> The following was posted to CCD-world: This winter and spring, UCLA Extension will present the following short course on the UCLA campus in Los Angeles. May 8-12, 2000, "Charge-Coupled Devices/CMOS Imaging Sensors and Cameras". The instructors are James R. Janesick, MS, PixelVision; Terrence Lomheim, PhD, The Aerospace Corporation; and Bedabrata Pain, PhD, Jet Propulsion Laboratory, $1695. For additional information and complete course descriptions, please visit our web page, http://www.unex.ucla.edu/shortcourses/, or contact Marcus Hennessy at: (310) 825-1047 (310) 206-2815 fax mhenness@unex.ucla.edu This course may also be presented on-site at company locations. - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From cgt at aaoepp.aao.gov.au Fri Jan 21 17:46:48 2000 From: cgt at aaoepp.aao.gov.au (Chris Tinney) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:40 2004 Subject: CCD-world: Help on Flexible PC suppliers? Message-ID: <200001210546.QAA24305@further.aao.gov.au> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 3332 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.ctio.noao.edu/pipermail/ccd-world/attachments/20000121/89313f40/attachment.bat From pcm at ing.iac.es Fri Jan 21 11:19:07 2000 From: pcm at ing.iac.es (Peter Moore) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:40 2004 Subject: CCD-world: Help on Flexible PC suppliers? In-Reply-To: <200001210546.QAA24305@further.aao.gov.au> Message-ID: The following was posted to CCD-world: Dear Chris, You might try : David Braithwaite Technical Sales Manager Tru-Lon Printed Circuits Newark Close York Way Industrial Estate Royston, Herts SG8 5HL, UK Tel: +44 (0) 1763 248922 Fax: +44 (0) 1763 249281 Mobile: +44 (0) 468 424934 Although we have not yet used their services, they have expressed interest and confidence in a similar project of ours which involves a seven layer stack with 0.1mm Cu track and spacing spec on Teflon. Hope this helps, Peter. =+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+ ING +===+===+===+===+===+===+===+= = Peter Moore, Isaac Newton Group, La Palma Observatory, Spain. = = E-mail pcm@ing.iac.es Voice Office +34 922 405566 = = S-mail Apartado de Correo 321, Fax Office +34 922 405646 = = 38780 Santa Cruz de La Palma, Voice Home +34 922 435042 = = Canary Islands, Spain. = =+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+ LPO +===+===+===+===+===+===+===+= - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From droege at wwa.com Fri Jan 21 20:26:49 2000 From: droege at wwa.com (Tom Droege) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:40 2004 Subject: CCD-world: Help on Flexible PC suppliers? Message-ID: <3.0.32.20000121192645.012411c4@pop.wwa.com> The following was posted to CCD-world: The supplier of "last resort" in the US in my experience (Fermilab) has been a company I remember as "Shieldal" in MN. Sorry I could not find them in a 10 min web search. They would make circuit boards no one else would touch. I will search more if you do not find a supplier. they made long Kapton cables for us. Not cheap. They have probably been bought out by someone. Tom Droege At 04:46 PM 1/21/00 +1100, you wrote: >The following was posted to CCD-world: > > >Dear CCD-World gurus, > >we have recently found at the AAO that our >instruments are moving into areas where our >current flexible PCB suppliers can no longer >be relied on. > >Can we get some recomendations on people's >preferred flexible PCB suppliers? A >detailed specification of our requirements is >attached, however to summarise. > >* Flexible PCB - only millimetre motions at most > after installation. >* Use in vacuum and temps at least 77K >* Polyimide and teflon have been OK in past >*** Low capacitance!! >* Sizes from 80mm x 150mm up to 60mm x 400mm > >Thanks in advance, > >Chris T. > >> >> >> Dear Sir/Madam, >> >> for my current project I require approximately >> 18 different flexible printed circuits, possibly panelised >> into 4 or 6 groups depending on your available panel sizes. >> >> These flex circuit will be used to replace wiring within >> a cryogenic camera, the boards have no components on them >> except for a connector at each end, where stiffeners are >> required. The circuit will not be flexed continuously just >> shaped initially then only a few millimetres movement will >> be required infrequently. The flex material must be >> suitable for use in a vacuum and at low temperature (we >> have tested polyimide and teflon material at our operating >> temperature and found both acceptable). >> >> The most important of our requirements is low capacitance. >> Therefore the base material we prefer is 0.005" teflon with >> a dielectric constant (Dk) < 2.5, however other 0.005" base >> materials may be suitable such as Kapton KN (R/Flex2001) >> with a Dk = 3.2 or polyester (Dk = 3.1) although we have >> not verified polyester at our operating temperature. >> >> The sizes of each flex range from 80mm x 150mm up to 60mm x >> 400mm. >> >> General specifications for the flex circuits: >> >> 1. Double sided copper with plated through holes. >> 1oz finished copper weight. >> >> 2. Track width 0.006", spacing >0.010". >> Solid or 45 deg. cross hatched ground plane on one side. >> >> 3. Hole sizes >0.020", annulus >0.010". >> Aprox. 50 holes per board. >> >> 4. Insulating layer or solder resist both sides. >> >> 5. 0.005" stiffener over the ends (1 side) approx. 15mm >> long. >> >> 6. No silkscreen. >> >> 7. Silver (preferred) or solder finish on pads. >> >> 8. Protel CAD files or Gerber files available for >> manufacturing. >> >> 9. Quantity will be 2 or 3 each of the 4 or 6 panels (18 >> types) initially. >> >> I believe these designs are not unusual and should >> not present any manufacturing problems apart from the >> selection of base material. Please let me know what >> suitable low Dk base materials you have available and >> rough idea of pricing for the production of these flex >> circuits. I also need your panel sizes and manufacturing >> time. >> >> ---------------------- >> Lewis Waller >> Anglo-Australian Observatory Email: lgw@aaoepp.aao.gov.au >> PO Box 296, Epping. NSW 2121 Tel: 61 2 93724831 >> 167 Vimiera Road, Eastwood. NSW 2122 Fax: 61 2 93724880 >> Australia >> >> >- -- CCD-world -- -- >CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk >Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. >For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ > - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From droege at wwa.com Fri Jan 21 21:04:05 2000 From: droege at wwa.com (Tom Droege) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:40 2004 Subject: CCD-world: Help on Flexible PC suppliers? Message-ID: <3.0.32.20000121200403.0100eb80@pop.wwa.com> The following was posted to CCD-world: OK, it was a struggle but I found them. At Fermilab we bought some pretty strange PC boards. Things like 4' x 10' printed circuit boards for Liquid Argon Calorimeters. Sheldahl was often the only supplier that would bid on such things. They were rarely the low bidder unless they were the only bidder. You will find someone there who understands your problem if you find it anywhere in the industry. Sheldahl, Inc. 1150 Sheldahl Rd. Northfield MN 55057 Tel 507 663 8000 Fax 507 663 8545 www.sheldahl.com I have no connection with Sheldahl etc.. Tom Droege At 04:46 PM 1/21/00 +1100, you wrote: >The following was posted to CCD-world: > > >Dear CCD-World gurus, > >we have recently found at the AAO that our >instruments are moving into areas where our >current flexible PCB suppliers can no longer >be relied on. > >Can we get some recomendations on people's >preferred flexible PCB suppliers? A >detailed specification of our requirements is >attached, however to summarise. > >* Flexible PCB - only millimetre motions at most > after installation. >* Use in vacuum and temps at least 77K >* Polyimide and teflon have been OK in past >*** Low capacitance!! >* Sizes from 80mm x 150mm up to 60mm x 400mm > >Thanks in advance, > >Chris T. > >> >> >> Dear Sir/Madam, >> >> for my current project I require approximately >> 18 different flexible printed circuits, possibly panelised >> into 4 or 6 groups depending on your available panel sizes. >> >> These flex circuit will be used to replace wiring within >> a cryogenic camera, the boards have no components on them >> except for a connector at each end, where stiffeners are >> required. The circuit will not be flexed continuously just >> shaped initially then only a few millimetres movement will >> be required infrequently. The flex material must be >> suitable for use in a vacuum and at low temperature (we >> have tested polyimide and teflon material at our operating >> temperature and found both acceptable). >> >> The most important of our requirements is low capacitance. >> Therefore the base material we prefer is 0.005" teflon with >> a dielectric constant (Dk) < 2.5, however other 0.005" base >> materials may be suitable such as Kapton KN (R/Flex2001) >> with a Dk = 3.2 or polyester (Dk = 3.1) although we have >> not verified polyester at our operating temperature. >> >> The sizes of each flex range from 80mm x 150mm up to 60mm x >> 400mm. >> >> General specifications for the flex circuits: >> >> 1. Double sided copper with plated through holes. >> 1oz finished copper weight. >> >> 2. Track width 0.006", spacing >0.010". >> Solid or 45 deg. cross hatched ground plane on one side. >> >> 3. Hole sizes >0.020", annulus >0.010". >> Aprox. 50 holes per board. >> >> 4. Insulating layer or solder resist both sides. >> >> 5. 0.005" stiffener over the ends (1 side) approx. 15mm >> long. >> >> 6. No silkscreen. >> >> 7. Silver (preferred) or solder finish on pads. >> >> 8. Protel CAD files or Gerber files available for >> manufacturing. >> >> 9. Quantity will be 2 or 3 each of the 4 or 6 panels (18 >> types) initially. >> >> I believe these designs are not unusual and should >> not present any manufacturing problems apart from the >> selection of base material. Please let me know what >> suitable low Dk base materials you have available and >> rough idea of pricing for the production of these flex >> circuits. I also need your panel sizes and manufacturing >> time. >> >> ---------------------- >> Lewis Waller >> Anglo-Australian Observatory Email: lgw@aaoepp.aao.gov.au >> PO Box 296, Epping. NSW 2121 Tel: 61 2 93724831 >> 167 Vimiera Road, Eastwood. NSW 2122 Fax: 61 2 93724880 >> Australia >> >> >- -- CCD-world -- -- >CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk >Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. >For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ > - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From reinhold.dorn at eso.org Wed Jan 26 18:21:53 2000 From: reinhold.dorn at eso.org (Reinhold Dorn) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:40 2004 Subject: CCD-world: ESO's Optical Detector Team - updated web pages Message-ID: <388F1F21.EAC57D88@eso.org> The following was posted to CCD-world: Dear CCD world, The Optical Detector Team at the European Southern Observatory has set up a couple of new Web pages. We would like to give interested people an overview on the recent work carried out at ESO and the latest performance results and finding for a broad range of different CCD devices. Please note that the pages are still under construction and we will add more information as soon as we find time. You can find the pages under the following link, comments are welcome. http://www.eso.org/projects/odt/ With best wishes, Reinhold Dorn and Cyril Cavadore ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Reinhold Dorn e-mail:reinhold.dorn@eso.org Optical Detector Team Instrumentation Division ESO - European Southern Observatory phone: +49-89-32006-547 Karl-Schwarzschildstr.2,D-85748 Garching fax: +49-89-32006-606 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From conroy at mso.anu.edu.au Mon Jan 31 22:36:38 2000 From: conroy at mso.anu.edu.au (Peter Conroy) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:40 2004 Subject: CCD-world: Second Hand CCD Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.20000131213638.0096b340@mso.anu.edu.au> The following was posted to CCD-world: Dear CCD-World. We are seeking to purchase a well loved, well behaved, pre owned CCD. Is there any group out there in CCD-World with a small stock of 1x1K x 15 micron pixel, thinned CCD's. We need just one good CCD plus a setup grade for a fibre fed spectrograph project. Regards -------------------------------------------------------------------- Peter Conroy - Senior Draftsman - Design Office Mt Stromlo Observatory - Canberra Australia Private Bag Weston Creek PO ACT 2611 Australia Email - conroy@mso.anu.edu.au Phone - 61 02 6279 8022 Fax - 61 02 6249 0233 http://www.mso.anu.edu.au/~conroy -------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From john.c.flemming at lmco.com Mon Jan 31 09:16:23 2000 From: john.c.flemming at lmco.com (Flemming, John C) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:40 2004 Subject: CCD-world: Help on Flexible PC suppliers? Message-ID: <667ED598F8A2D311981D00508B122380B2B9DF@emss02m04.ems.lmco.com> The following was posted to CCD-world: Note the mispelling. Sheldahl is alive and well Acess via any search engine will work. > -----Original Message----- > From: Tom Droege [SMTP:droege@wwa.com] > Sent: Friday, January 21, 2000 6:27 PM > To: CCD-world@astro.ku.dk > Subject: Re: CCD-world: Help on Flexible PC suppliers? > > The following was posted to CCD-world: > > The supplier of "last resort" in the US in my experience (Fermilab) has > been a company I remember as "Shieldal" in MN. Sorry I could not find > them > in a 10 min web search. They would make circuit boards no one else would > touch. I will search more if you do not find a supplier. they made long > Kapton cables for us. Not cheap. > > They have probably been bought out by someone. > > Tom Droege > > At 04:46 PM 1/21/00 +1100, you wrote: > >The following was posted to CCD-world: > > > > > >Dear CCD-World gurus, > > > >we have recently found at the AAO that our > >instruments are moving into areas where our > >current flexible PCB suppliers can no longer > >be relied on. > > > >Can we get some recomendations on people's > >preferred flexible PCB suppliers? A > >detailed specification of our requirements is > >attached, however to summarise. > > > >* Flexible PCB - only millimetre motions at most > > after installation. > >* Use in vacuum and temps at least 77K > >* Polyimide and teflon have been OK in past > >*** Low capacitance!! > >* Sizes from 80mm x 150mm up to 60mm x 400mm > > > >Thanks in advance, > > > >Chris T. > > > >> > >> > >> Dear Sir/Madam, > >> > >> for my current project I require approximately > >> 18 different flexible printed circuits, possibly panelised > >> into 4 or 6 groups depending on your available panel sizes. > >> > >> These flex circuit will be used to replace wiring within > >> a cryogenic camera, the boards have no components on them > >> except for a connector at each end, where stiffeners are > >> required. The circuit will not be flexed continuously just > >> shaped initially then only a few millimetres movement will > >> be required infrequently. The flex material must be > >> suitable for use in a vacuum and at low temperature (we > >> have tested polyimide and teflon material at our operating > >> temperature and found both acceptable). > >> > >> The most important of our requirements is low capacitance. > >> Therefore the base material we prefer is 0.005" teflon with > >> a dielectric constant (Dk) < 2.5, however other 0.005" base > >> materials may be suitable such as Kapton KN (R/Flex2001) > >> with a Dk = 3.2 or polyester (Dk = 3.1) although we have > >> not verified polyester at our operating temperature. > >> > >> The sizes of each flex range from 80mm x 150mm up to 60mm x > >> 400mm. > >> > >> General specifications for the flex circuits: > >> > >> 1. Double sided copper with plated through holes. > >> 1oz finished copper weight. > >> > >> 2. Track width 0.006", spacing >0.010". > >> Solid or 45 deg. cross hatched ground plane on one side. > >> > >> 3. Hole sizes >0.020", annulus >0.010". > >> Aprox. 50 holes per board. > >> > >> 4. Insulating layer or solder resist both sides. > >> > >> 5. 0.005" stiffener over the ends (1 side) approx. 15mm > >> long. > >> > >> 6. No silkscreen. > >> > >> 7. Silver (preferred) or solder finish on pads. > >> > >> 8. Protel CAD files or Gerber files available for > >> manufacturing. > >> > >> 9. Quantity will be 2 or 3 each of the 4 or 6 panels (18 > >> types) initially. > >> > >> I believe these designs are not unusual and should > >> not present any manufacturing problems apart from the > >> selection of base material. Please let me know what > >> suitable low Dk base materials you have available and > >> rough idea of pricing for the production of these flex > >> circuits. I also need your panel sizes and manufacturing > >> time. > >> > >> ---------------------- > >> Lewis Waller > >> Anglo-Australian Observatory Email: lgw@aaoepp.aao.gov.au > >> PO Box 296, Epping. NSW 2121 Tel: 61 2 93724831 > >> 167 Vimiera Road, Eastwood. NSW 2122 Fax: 61 2 93724880 > >> Australia > >> > >> > >- -- CCD-world -- -- > >CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk > >Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. > >For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ > > > - -- CCD-world -- -- > CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk > Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. > For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From guillaume at obs-hp.fr Wed Feb 2 18:58:20 2000 From: guillaume at obs-hp.fr (C.GUILLAUME) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:41 2004 Subject: CCD-world: Looking for a dewar Message-ID: <001301bf6d9e$b584c1a0$2fa086c0@obshp.fr> The following was posted to CCD-world: Hi CCD world !.. We have planed to order a dewar to carry on our developpements but we were advised that the delivery time is about 2 months, and we need it for test in a short time. To avoid blocking our tests for a so long time, we are currently looking for a LN2 dewar,even of secondhand for buying or for a loan.(could be for a couple of months !..) However it should be an Infrared Labs ND8 model, since we are already using this model and all the devices developed at OHP were made built for that type. If interrested please contact me at the following adress. Many thanks for your replies. ----------------------------- ? Christian GUILLAUME ? Service Electronique ? CNRS / OSU Marseille-Provence Tel: (33).04.92.70.64.09 ? Observatoire de Haute Provence Fax: (33).04.92.70.64.64 ? 04870 St Michel l'Observatoire Email: guillaume@obs-hp.fr --------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From pcm at ing.iac.es Fri Feb 11 13:47:49 2000 From: pcm at ing.iac.es (Peter Moore) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:41 2004 Subject: CCD-world: Rockwell Hawaii question - stars abound ! In-Reply-To: <667ED598F8A2D311981D00508B122380B2B9DF@emss02m04.ems.lmco.com> Message-ID: The following was posted to CCD-world: Dear Colleagues, I am currently characterising a Rockwell 1024x1024 MCT array for use in our NIR imager INGRID due to be commissioned soon (to soon :-). (see http://www.ing.iac.es/IR/INGRID/ingrid1_home.htm) I am experiencing problems of high noise due to very many hot pixels that are spatially stable. I am using a basic cds (reset - read - integrate - read) scheme running on a sdsu controller for readout. The number of hot events depends on some threshold that seems to be linked with the number of reads performed (more reads, more stars). The amplitude is significant (6K - 20K ADU at Vrst 0.55v) and can be varied using the reset voltage. If I hold the reset on while reading there are no events, if I switch the reset clock off, the events reach 60K ADU. I'm using offboard FET source followers with the onboard biasgate FET set to 3.4v and the biaspower at 5.2v. Holding the reset gate on and moving Vrst to 0v also surpesses the events. Peeking between the events the noise floor is good at around 12e- rms. Response and linearity are good to about 100K e- at 4e-/ADU gain. I'm thinking it has something to do with the current flowing through the horizontal mux switch but what to do about it is driving me nuts :-) Any help on this problem would be very much appreciated ! Best regards to all of you, Peter. =+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+ ING +===+===+===+===+===+===+===+= = Peter Moore, Isaac Newton Group, La Palma Observatory, Spain. = = E-mail pcm@ing.iac.es Voice Office +34 922 405566 = = S-mail Apartado de Correo 321, Fax Office +34 922 405646 = = 38780 Santa Cruz de La Palma, Voice Home +34 922 435042 = = Canary Islands, Spain. = =+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+ LPO +===+===+===+===+===+===+===+= - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From zzwang at class1.bao.ac.cn Sat Feb 12 12:50:41 2000 From: zzwang at class1.bao.ac.cn (Zhaowang Zhao) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:41 2004 Subject: CCD-world: About THOMSON TH7899 2048x2048 CCD References: Message-ID: <001a01bf750c$54d3fea0$3a58e29f@bao.ac.cn> The following was posted to CCD-world: Dear Colleagues, I want to design a CCD controller with TH7899 Thomson 2048x2048 chip. I hope fast clean CCD less than 100ms. Who have used such CCD and how to design the timing is better? Best Regards Zhaowang Zhao Beijing Astronomical Observatory Datun Rd. #20A Chaoyang District Beijing 100012 China zzwang@class1.bao.ac.cn Tel:86-10-64877312 Fax:86-10-64877308 - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From starr at cfht.hawaii.edu Fri Feb 11 13:01:19 2000 From: starr at cfht.hawaii.edu (Barry Starr) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:41 2004 Subject: CCD-world: Rockwell Hawaii question - stars abound ! References: Message-ID: <38A486AF.868@cfht.hawaii.edu> The following was posted to CCD-world: Hi Peter, We're currently building our second camera based on the Rockwell 1024 x 1024 HAWAII Array. The first system used a modified SDSU I system and a CFHT preamp I designed specifically for the HAWAII array. Our second system is using the SDSU II system again with the CFHT preamp. In our system the preamp provides the clock drivers (and FPGA pattern generator) which in the case of the HAWAII array is very simple due to the CMOS input levels. I insert series resistors with the clock driver IC (this works with the FPA input capacitance) to rolloff the rise time to an appropriate rate of change and limit the clock current spiking. We had an occurence similar to this initially that turned out to be a digital data handling artifact in our system, I don't think that's what your describing here. In order to test for this we have digital pattern generation capability in all our SDSU Timing Board readout routines to test communication links and data processing. This has been very valuable I recommend it if your don't currently use it, can be very helpful in debugging. In our setup we have not (yet) noticed your particular artifact. We have noticed some other interesting artifacts in the HAWAII array specifically an exponential gradient on read following a reset that according to Rockwell has been noted before in the HAWAII arrays. I'm curious to hear if others have experienced this anomaly. It is a fucntion of time and clocking. Fortunately with the appropriate clocking delay the CDS removes the gradient effect very well after the first line. Back to the issue at hand, Rockwell has told me of charge injection issues regarding the clocking and in particular the reset lines of their FPAs, this may be what's happening. A few general questions, sorry if any appear obvious. Have you looked at the indiviual images and seen where the effect is occuring? First read? Second read? You mentioned that multiple reads increase the occurence? Can you store multiple reads as individual images? If you can, does the artifact stay in the subsequent images once it occurs? In other words is it coupling to the photosite or is it coupling into your readout? Is there any commonality among or between quadrants? or is there any evident spatial pattern to the events? Possible causes I'd look in three areas: 1) clock patterns 2) clock rates (particularly rise/fall times) 3) bias and grounds Regarding clock patterns with your reset read int read pattern (CDS), Rockwell recommends pulsing the reset line at the beginning of each line on the array, cycling through the entire array reset cycle without reading, then they read (with reset inactive) the array storing this as image 1, then integrate, followed by the second read image 2, final image = image2 - image 1. Is this your clocking pattern? Regarding clock rates, What clock rates are you using and what rise/fall times on your clocks? Does the anomaly vary when you slow the clocks or in particular roll off the rise times? I'd recommend rolling them off as much as your clock rates will allow (within reason of course). I'd suspect the rise/fall times first. And finally on the bias and ground lines, are your connections low impedance, some times this is difficult in dewar using constantin or maganin wire. Can you monitor these lines when your camera is warm and open and see if they are stable and glitch free? Hope some of this helps, good luck on the fix, please let us know what you find. Barry Peter Moore wrote: > > The following was posted to CCD-world: > > Dear Colleagues, > > I am currently characterising a Rockwell 1024x1024 MCT array for use in > our NIR imager INGRID due to be commissioned soon (to soon :-). > (see http://www.ing.iac.es/IR/INGRID/ingrid1_home.htm) > > I am experiencing problems of high noise due to very many hot pixels that > are spatially stable. I am using a basic cds (reset - read - integrate - > read) scheme running on a sdsu controller for readout. The number of hot > events depends on some threshold that seems to be linked with the number > of reads performed (more reads, more stars). The amplitude is significant > (6K - 20K ADU at Vrst 0.55v) and can be varied using the reset voltage. If > I hold the reset on while reading there are no events, if I switch the > reset clock off, the events reach 60K ADU. I'm using offboard FET source > followers with the onboard biasgate FET set to 3.4v and the biaspower at > 5.2v. Holding the reset gate on and moving Vrst to 0v also surpesses the > events. > > Peeking between the events the noise floor is good at around 12e- rms. > Response and linearity are good to about 100K e- at 4e-/ADU gain. > > I'm thinking it has something to do with the current flowing through the > horizontal mux switch but what to do about it is driving me nuts :-) > > Any help on this problem would be very much appreciated ! > > Best regards to all of you, > Peter. > > =+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+ ING +===+===+===+===+===+===+===+= > = Peter Moore, Isaac Newton Group, La Palma Observatory, Spain. = > = E-mail pcm@ing.iac.es Voice Office +34 922 405566 = > = S-mail Apartado de Correo 321, Fax Office +34 922 405646 = > = 38780 Santa Cruz de La Palma, Voice Home +34 922 435042 = > = Canary Islands, Spain. = > =+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+ LPO +===+===+===+===+===+===+===+= > > - -- CCD-world -- -- > CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk > Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. > For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ -- _____________________________________________________________________________ Barry Michael Starr starr@cfht.hawaii.edu Canada France Hawaii Telescope Ph: 808-885-3139 PO BOX 1793 Kamuela, HI 96743 Fax: 808-885-7288 _____________________________________________________________________________ - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From Paul.Jorden at eev.com Mon Feb 14 10:45:58 2000 From: Paul.Jorden at eev.com (Paul.Jorden@eev.com) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:41 2004 Subject: CCD-world: About THOMSON TH7899 2048 Message-ID: The following was posted to CCD-world: To Zhaowang Zhao, cc: ccd-world > > I want to design a CCD controller with TH7899 Thomson 2048x2048 chip. > I hope fast clean CCD less than 100ms. Who have used such CCD and how to > design the timing is better? Greetings. I cannot comment on the above chip. If you ever plan to operate high efficiency backside thinned chips (like the Marconi CCD42-40) you might find that parallel clocking times increase somewhat. In this case the unique 'dump drain' facility on the 42-40 allows much faster clearing of the chip. The data sheet (on web page below) for the similar 42-80 device explains it.... Good luck! Paul _______________________________________________________________ Please note change of name from 'EEV' to 'Marconi Applied Technologies'. _______________________________________________________________ Dr Paul Jorden, CCD Sensors, Marconi Applied Technologies Waterhouse Lane, Chelmsford, Essex, CM1 2QU, UK Tel: 44 (0) 1245 -453458 (direct), -493493 (switchboard) Fax: 44 (0) 1245 453224 http://www.marconi-technologies.co.uk/products/ccd/ccdprod.html - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From Jenichen at proscan.de Mon Feb 14 17:31:29 2000 From: Jenichen at proscan.de (Jenichen) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:41 2004 Subject: CCD-world: About THOMSON TH7899 2048 References: Message-ID: <38A81FD1.8CC78562@proscan.de> The following was posted to CCD-world: Paul.Jorden@eev.com schrieb: > The following was posted to CCD-world: > > To Zhaowang Zhao, > cc: ccd-world > > > > I want to design a CCD controller with TH7899 Thomson 2048x2048 chip. > > I hope fast clean CCD less than 100ms. Who have used such CCD and how to > > design the timing is better? > > Greetings. > I cannot comment on the above chip. > If you ever plan to operate high efficiency backside thinned chips (like the Marconi CCD42-40) you might find that parallel clocking times increase somewhat. In this case the unique 'dump drain' facility on the 42-40 allows much faster clearing of the chip. The data sheet (on web page below) for the similar 42-80 device explains it.... > > Good luck! > > Paul Could You please advise me which of Your backilluminated CCD (1kx1k or 2kx2k) are able to be clocked as fast as Zhao wants. We are very interested in fast backilluminated CCD but Your distributor could not explain which are good for fast clocking and which performance they achieve in this mode (2 -10 Mhz, readout frequency). We use the 2k x2k TH CCD and we are pleased with the quality. -- Best regards / Mit freundlichen Gruessen Frank Jenichen Proscan elektronische Systeme GmbH Tel.: +49 8195 999 -511 Fax: -512 mailto:Jenichen@proscan.de ------------------------------------------------------------ More information concerning our products and services can be found on our website http://www.proscan.de - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From Paul.Jorden at eev.com Mon Feb 14 17:36:26 2000 From: Paul.Jorden at eev.com (Paul.Jorden@eev.com) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:41 2004 Subject: CCD-world: RE: About THOMSON TH7899 2048 & Marconi Message-ID: The following was posted to CCD-world: Frank, et al, > > Could You please advise me which of Your backilluminated CCD (1kx1k or > 2kx2k) are able to be clocked as fast as Zhao wants. We are very > interested in fast backilluminated CCD but Your distributor could not > explain which are good for fast clocking and which performance they > achieve in this mode (2 -10 Mhz, readout frequency). We use the 2k > x2k TH CCD and we are pleased with the quality. The CCD42-40 is 2k&2k with 13.5 um pixels, non-IMO, and backthinned for high QE, with low noise. Although it may have a lower serial clocking speed than the TH chip, the provision of a dump drain means that it in not necessary to do a serial row scan during the clear cycle. Thus time to clear the chip is defined by the row clocking rate; row transfer time is ~ 20 uS for full well. [less than full-well signals will transfer faster] The serial clocks will go at 10 MHz, although <~ 1 Mhz is normal for signal sampling. There is also a CCD47-10 (1k*1k, 13 um pixels, full-frame) and the CCD47-20 (1k*1k, 13 um, FT). These have a row transfer rate of ~ 2 uS. They also have a dump drain to allow fast clearing. My sums say that a chip could easily be cleared in 10 mS. Note that backthined, IMO (MPP) devices can have slower clocking rates than quoted above. Regards, Paul _______________________________________________________________ Please note change of name from 'EEV' to 'Marconi Applied Technologies'. _______________________________________________________________ Dr Paul Jorden, CCD Sensors, Marconi Applied Technologies Waterhouse Lane, Chelmsford, Essex, CM1 2QU, UK Tel: 44 (0) 1245 -453458 (direct), -493493 (switchboard) Fax: 44 (0) 1245 453224 http://www.marconi-technologies.co.uk/products/ccd/ccdprod.html - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From MYPIXEL at aol.com Mon Feb 14 16:50:21 2000 From: MYPIXEL at aol.com (MYPIXEL@aol.com) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:41 2004 Subject: CCD-world: High Speed Erasure Message-ID: The following was posted to CCD-world: In a message dated 2/12/00 7:57:54 AM EST, zzwang@class1.bao.ac.cn writes: << The following was posted to CCD-world: Dear Colleagues, I want to design a CCD controller with TH7899 Thomson 2048x2048 chip. I hope fast clean CCD less than 100ms. Who have used such CCD and how to design the timing is better? ***************************jj Zhaowang, "High speed erasure" for multi-phase CCDs without a dump drain.. . . . . It is best to take the vertical clocks to a lower potential (typically inverted) than the horizontal clocks (typically a few volts above inversion). This will allow the horizontal register to act as a drain and prevent "charge backup" problems into the array during high speed erasure. Charge will bloom in the horizontal register and leave the reset switch under these bias conditions. Erasures times < 10 ms have been acheived for conventional 1024 x 1024 mulit-phase CCDs under full well conditions. This operating mode is working well for the Cassini mission where high speed erasure is required for the 1024 x 1024 three-phase CCDs on board. Jim *******************************jj Best Regards Zhaowang Zhao Beijing Astronomical Observatory Datun Rd. #20A Chaoyang District Beijing 100012 China zzwang@class1.bao.ac.cn >> - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From Paul.Jorden at eev.com Fri Feb 18 16:03:27 2000 From: Paul.Jorden at eev.com (Paul.Jorden@eev.com) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:41 2004 Subject: CCD-world: Marconi CCD update Message-ID: The following was posted to CCD-world: Hi everyone, - a quick msg to say that our web pages are being updated. From today you should see an updated list of some large format devices that are available ex-stock. [Follow the link from the CCD product page] There should also be more technical infomation added over the next week or so. Contact me for more info. BTW, has anyone else noticed that the SPIE March Munich meeting has wavefront sensors (conf 4007) scheduled at the same time as science CCDs (conf 4008)? As a detector specialist I'd be torn between the two on Wed 29th morning! Regards to all, Paul _______________________________________________________________ Please note change of name from 'EEV' to 'Marconi Applied Technologies'. _______________________________________________________________ Dr Paul Jorden, CCD Sensors, Marconi Applied Technologies Waterhouse Lane, Chelmsford, Essex, CM1 2QU, UK Tel: 44 (0) 1245 -453458 (direct), -493493 (switchboard) Fax: 44 (0) 1245 453224 http://www.marconi-technologies.co.uk/products/ccd/ccdprod.html - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From mark at mso.anu.edu.au Mon Feb 21 17:48:35 2000 From: mark at mso.anu.edu.au (Mark Downing) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:41 2004 Subject: CCD-world: detector engineer advertisement Message-ID: <200002210548.QAA02003@mephisto.anu.edu.au> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 887 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.ctio.noao.edu/pipermail/ccd-world/attachments/20000221/312c58de/attachment.bat From reif at astro.uni-bonn.de Thu Feb 24 12:54:41 2000 From: reif at astro.uni-bonn.de (Klaus Reif) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:41 2004 Subject: CCD-world: S16D interface, circular buffer mode Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20000224115441.007e6b40@aibn55> The following was posted to CCD-world: Hi all, we have to implement the control and data acqusition software for the Bonn University Simultaneous Camera (BUSCA, http://www.astro.uni-bonn.de/~ccd/busca/busca.html) on a Sparc10 (Solaris 2.5). (The software was developed and is running currently on a DEC Alpha.) It seems that everything works fine except for the circular buffer data acquisition mode of Sbus S16D DMA interface. Tranferring data into a single buffer (tested up to 32MB) does work. But BUSCA does have 4 CCD systems with 4Kx4K pixels (each). To transfer the >128MB we need to make use of the circular buffer mode: On the DECAlpha we have realized a real time display of the CCD data and some calculations (data statistics) and the disk transfer are running in parallel to the CDD readout. According to the S16D documentation this mode is available. But we didn't get it working yet. The documantation is bad. Who uses the S16D and got this particular mode working, so that I can ask him for further help? Thank you, Klaus Reif ******************************************************************* Klaus Reif Sternwarte of the Univ. of Bonn Phone: +49 228 737834 Auf dem Huegel 71 FAX: +49 228 733672 D 53121 Bonn Email: reif@astro.uni-bonn.de Germany WWW: http://www.astro.uni-bonn.de/~reif ******************************************************************* - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From isani at cfht.hawaii.edu Thu Feb 24 11:59:37 2000 From: isani at cfht.hawaii.edu (Sidik Isani) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:41 2004 Subject: CCD-world: S16D interface... Message-ID: <200002242059.KAA15135@otto.cfht.hawaii.edu> The following was posted to CCD-world: Hello List, Klaus - I got S16D+DMA ring buffer mode working for our CFH12K camera. Our system has worked reliably on a Sparc 20 with Solaris 2.5 and 2.6. Indeed, EDT's documentation has a few errors, and fails to point out some pitfalls. I hope something here can help you out... It's been a while, but here are some quick notes off of the top of my head: - I would use "libedt" from www.edt.com to program DMA mode. All the calls look like edt_something(). Also look on their Web site for the latest dmalib.pdf (or whatever they call the document that shows how to use the library.) - If you use that, you *should* be able to switch to an EDT PCI16D later on and just re-compile your code. You alpha machine has a PCI bus? There's probably no driver for the PCI16D for that machine though, unfortunately. - EDT needs to upgrade old rev. boards or DMA mode will not work on sun4m architectures! This was not covered under warranty. They will be able to tell you if your rev. is ok or not. Try calling EDT. They are a small company, and their telephone support is reasonably quick if the right person is in. If *they* don't remember, I can look for e-mails exchanged with them on this subject, but they should be able to tell you. - Other known features of the EDT software: o edt_byte_count() is off by 2 (subtract 2 to get the right value.) o edt_byte_count() may return strange values during a transfer, because the update of the counter is not atomic. (We detect the end of the readout by checking for the same byte count twice in a row, and then we know _that_ value is reliable.) o Your readout size should be a multiple of 16 _words_, in DMA mode. This is the size of the FIFO in the card, I believe. If the last few pixels don't fill it up, you will loose them. This only happens with odd subraster sizes, and we work around it by padding zeroes. o Make sure S16S_RTIMEOUT is 0 before configuring ring buffers. This read timeout does not work/apply(?) in DMA mode and should be set to zero. o Be sure you always exit DMA mode cleanly in all cases before going back to any regular I/O. (edt_disable_ring_buffers()). o I had a few problems with handling of the ALARM signal with programs linked with libedt. If you do anything that uses SIGALRM, maybe save/restore the signal mask and interrupt vectors each time. I'd check with EDT (the phone number is on their Web site) and find out if your board needs to be upgraded first... Good luck! - Sidik Klaus Reif typed: > Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 11:54:41 +0100 > To: CCD-world@astro.ku.dk > From: Klaus Reif > Subject: CCD-world: S16D interface, circular buffer mode > > Hi all, > > we have to implement the control and data acqusition software > for the Bonn University Simultaneous Camera (BUSCA, > http://www.astro.uni-bonn.de/~ccd/busca/busca.html) on a Sparc10 > (Solaris 2.5). (The software was developed and is running currently > on a DEC Alpha.) It seems that everything works fine except for the > circular buffer data acquisition mode of Sbus S16D DMA interface. > Tranferring data into a single buffer (tested up to 32MB) does work. > But BUSCA does have 4 CCD systems with 4Kx4K pixels (each). > To transfer the >128MB we need to make use of the circular buffer mode: > On the DECAlpha we have realized a real time display of the CCD data > and some calculations (data statistics) and the disk transfer are > running in parallel to the CDD readout. According to the S16D > documentation this mode is available. But we didn't get it working yet. > The documantation is bad. > > Who uses the S16D and got this particular mode working, so that I can ask > him for further help? > > Thank you, Klaus Reif > ******************************************************************* > Klaus Reif > Sternwarte of the Univ. of Bonn Phone: +49 228 737834 > Auf dem Huegel 71 FAX: +49 228 733672 > D 53121 Bonn Email: > reif@astro.uni-bonn.de > Germany WWW: > http://www.astro.uni-bonn.de/~reif > ******************************************************************* > > > > > > - -- CCD-world -- -- > CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk > Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. > For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ > - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From bgoodin at unex.ucla.edu Sun Mar 5 17:26:31 2000 From: bgoodin at unex.ucla.edu (Goodin, Bill) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:41 2004 Subject: CCD-world: UCLA spring short course on CCD/CMOS Imaging Sensors Message-ID: <86A3B318912ED311BCE500A0C960C70601A64969@www3.unex.ucla.edu> The following was posted to CCD-world: > This spring, UCLA Extension will present the following short course on > the UCLA campus in Los Angeles. > > May 8-12, 2000, "Charge-Coupled Devices/CMOS Imaging Sensors and > Cameras". The instructors are James R. Janesick, MS, PixelVision; > Terrence Lomheim, PhD, The Aerospace Corporation; and Bedabrata > Pain, PhD, Jet Propulsion Laboratory, $1695. > > For additional information and a complete course description, please > visit our web page, http://www.unex.ucla.edu/shortcourses/, > > or contact Marcus Hennessy at: > (310) 825-1047 > (310) 206-2815 fax > mhenness@unex.ucla.edu > > This course may also be presented on-site at company locations. > - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From ballesteros_ at hotmail.com Thu Mar 9 11:43:03 2000 From: ballesteros_ at hotmail.com (Leomar Acosta) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:42 2004 Subject: CCD-world: KAF-0400C Message-ID: <20000309184303.91905.qmail@hotmail.com> The following was posted to CCD-world: Dear sir: I am interested in buy a Chip CCD Kodak KAF-0400C of secondhand in well condition. Please, if there is someone that know about this, send my a email. Leomar Acosta B. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From Paul.Jorden at eev.com Fri Mar 10 16:47:07 2000 From: Paul.Jorden at eev.com (Paul.Jorden@eev.com) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:42 2004 Subject: CCD-world: available large Marconi CCDs-update Message-ID: The following was posted to CCD-world: Hi to all, We've just updated our list of available large-format sensors. http://www.marconitech.com/products/ccd/forsale.html Some of them don't fit into the standard grade-specs, and are offered at appropriate prices. Any end-of-FY interest?- Contact , me for more info. Also, sometimes people want only part of a large device (eg 4k*1k, which is half of a normal CCD42-80 or CCD44-82). Sometimes chips occur that have many defects on one side only, and could serve the above purpose. If interested, contact me and I'll make up a 'waiting list'. [Please don't make your requirements too complex- I like an easy life!] Regards, Paul _______________________________________________________________ Please note change of name from 'EEV' to 'Marconi Applied Technologies'. _______________________________________________________________ Dr Paul Jorden, CCD Sensors, Marconi Applied Technologies Waterhouse Lane, Chelmsford, Essex, CM1 2QU, UK Tel: 44 (0) 1245 -453458 (direct), -493493 (switchboard) Fax: 44 (0) 1245 453224 http://www.marconitech.com/products/ccd/ccdprod.html - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From bedwards at gatan.com Mon Mar 20 11:37:27 2000 From: bedwards at gatan.com (Bob Edwards) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:42 2004 Subject: CCD-world: Job Posting: EE, CCD Design Message-ID: <38D67DF7.911276BB@gatan.com> Gatan, Inc. is a technology leader in high resolution digital imaging, analytical spectroscopy and ion beam milling applications for electron microscopes. We specialize in the development of high performance CCD cameras and analytical instruments based on those cameras. Our products are used in commercial and university research labs world wide. We are currently seeking to fill the following position: ELECTRICAL ENGINEER: CCD CAMERA DESIGN As a key member of the Imaging Products team you will be instrumental in developing our next generation of scientific grade, high speed, 14 and 16-bit digital CCD cameras. You will be responsible for design of new boards and systems from concept to production hand-off. This will include system architecture definition, detailed board design and system performance characterization. Requirements: BS/MSEE and 3+ years Digital and Analog design experience. Direct experience with PLDs, FPGAs and Op-Amps required. Experience with CCD design, low noise Analog design, Video systems, power supply and thermal management are all strong pluses. To apply, please mail, fax or email resume to : GATAN, Inc., Attn: HR Department 5933 Coronado Lane Pleasanton, CA. 94588 Fax: (925) 463-0204 email: bedwards@gatan.com www.gatan.com (Web Site Note: Our site is targeted towards the end users who are usually PhD electron microscope users. You'll have to read between the lines to see how much fun an EE can have here.) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: bedwards.vcf Type: text/x-vcard Size: 242 bytes Desc: Card for Bob Edwards Url : http://www.ctio.noao.edu/pipermail/ccd-world/attachments/20000320/0d9bef3e/bedwards.vcf From pcm at ing.iac.es Mon Mar 20 17:59:40 2000 From: pcm at ing.iac.es (Peter Moore) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:42 2004 Subject: CCD-world: Rockwell Hawaii question - stars abound ! In-Reply-To: <38A486AF.868@cfht.hawaii.edu> Message-ID: The following was posted to CCD-world: Hiya Barry, Thank you very much for your very detailed help that you gave us a month ago. I've been waiting till after we commissioned the camera to reply so as to collect the most information about the problem from the most recent modifications and tests. With regards to the hot pixels we've been able to determine the following :- 1. Hot pixels are spatially stable and are time dependent i.e they get 'hotter' as integration time increases. 2. The levels are pedistals and photon flux is still collected up to saturation level. 3. There is a decrease in the number and severity of them with a decrease in temperature. This leads me to conclude that we have some form of leakage from the pixel site itself that degrades the reset charge in time. This is also born out by the fact that some sites with severe discharge influence adjacent pixels (column and row). In addition the pedistal level shows a near expodential growth with time, very much like a discharge curve. I will in the future play with the clock, 'high', and vcc values to see if this influences them. I've gone through your helpful list and all points are in the green. BTW we are using 240 ns clock rise and fall times, pixel time is 1700 ns and reset time is 1000 ns. We have found that taking a bias of the same integration time as the science integration time and then subtracting this from the science cds image data gives near perfect subtraction of the hot pixels. The only concern then is that they limit the dynamic range of those affected pixels. We are getting a useful 'full well' capacity of just over 85K -e with a Vrest of 0.55v. At 68 Kelvin we see about 7% of pixels affected. Noise is a nominal 12 -e with a single read cds (mndr = 1). With regard to the ramp seen on early lines during readout, Derek sorted this out by doing a dummy read of n columns before actual readout. This exercised the internal mux electronics and flushed leakage (?) charge out minimising the effect. We now see about 10 ADU difference on the early columns that dissipates by column 50 when flushing 64 columns before readout. It was 100's of ADU before and now the residial dissappears completely by the cds subtraction. Thanks very much for the advice Barry and Craig, All the best in your endeavours, Peter. =+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+ ING +===+===+===+===+===+===+===+= = Peter Moore, Isaac Newton Group, La Palma Observatory, Spain. = = E-mail pcm@ing.iac.es Voice Office +34 922 405566 = = S-mail Apartado de Correo 321, Fax Office +34 922 405646 = = 38780 Santa Cruz de La Palma, Voice Home +34 922 435042 = = Canary Islands, Spain. = =+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+===+ LPO +===+===+===+===+===+===+===+= - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From Jenichen at proscan.de Tue Mar 21 13:29:23 2000 From: Jenichen at proscan.de (Jenichen) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:42 2004 Subject: CCD-world: scientific 4kx4k CCD Message-ID: <38D76B23.92CE3138@proscan.de> The following was posted to CCD-world: Hi folks, We are looking for manufactures of high performance 4k x 4k (or even more in one piece) scientific CCD. Could You please inform us about Your experience with them. Where is moved the Fairchild CCD production? thanks in advance -- Best regards / Mit freundlichen Gruessen Dr. Frank Jenichen Proscan elektronische Systeme GmbH Tel.: +49 8195 999 -511 Fax: -512 mailto:Jenichen@proscan.de ------------------------------------------------------------ More information concerning our products and services can be found on our website http://www.proscan.de - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From mlesser at as.arizona.edu Tue Mar 21 08:23:17 2000 From: mlesser at as.arizona.edu (Michael Lesser) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:42 2004 Subject: CCD-world: 4kx4k CCDs Message-ID: <001101bf9349$625fbb80$0bd0c480@as.arizona.edu> The following was posted to CCD-world: Hi Frank, You might contact Paul Vu (paul.vu@lmco.com) at Lockheed Martin Fairchild Systems regarding their 4kx4k CCDs. We have seen some beautiful devices from them. We have run both the older 485 CCDs and the new low-noise 486 scientific device. Dick Bredthauer (Semiconductor Technology Associates) has also made some 4kx4k devices bredthauer@home.com. -Mike Michael Lesser, Ph.D. Research Professor Steward Observatory University of Arizona Tucson, AZ 85721 (520) 621-4236 Office (520) 626-4330 FAX http://sauron.as.arizona.edu (520) 621-5207 Joanne McGinnis (admin assistant) - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From starr at cfht.hawaii.edu Wed Mar 22 11:27:41 2000 From: starr at cfht.hawaii.edu (Barry Starr) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:42 2004 Subject: CCD-world: cross-talk in multi-channel CCDs References: <3.0.5.32.20000322093739.00e74cc0@orion> Message-ID: <38D93ACD.72D@cfht.hawaii.edu> The following was posted to CCD-world: Hi Roy, Photon-forager, I like that, maybe Photon-phorager or Foton-forager... Anyway back to the matter at hand... The first thing I'd ask is have you tested your acquisition system performance separately from the CCD. If you still have the problem it's not the device (or only the device at least at the level your currently experiencing) if it goes away then either it's the CCD or your interface to the CCD. Split the chain if you can to see what's your offending party.... Regarding decoupling of video amplifiers, often the addition of more capacitance does not improve your decoupling due to the resonant frequency issues of non-ideal capacitors. Often you need to parallel 0.01uf ceramics with 1uF tantalums (surface mount best, extremely short leads mandatory) to get solid wideband decoupling. There is a wonderful application note by Analog Devices AN-202 "An IC Amplifier User's Guide to Decoupling, Grounding and Making Things Go Right for a Change" by Brokaw that's a classic (great title as well). But there's a load of good info for Analog Devices, Burr-Brown, and Linear Technology application notes in this area. Good Luck, Barry Roy Tucker wrote: > > The following was posted to CCD-world: > > Dear Fellow Photon-Foragers, > > I am participating in the up-grading of the GONG > (http://www.gong.noao.edu) video data system which includes a new camera > (Silicon Mountain Designs 1M60-20) with a Thomson THX7887A imager > (frontside 1024 square array, four channels of 1024 x 256, 14 um pixels, 60 > frames per second, 12 bits per pixel). Our data acquisition algorithm > consists generally of co-adding images for 60 seconds into three or six > accumulation buffers in synchrony with the angular orientation of rotating > optical elements in the system. Co-adding 600 or 1200 12-bit numbers > produces approximately 23-bit results. > > We are noticing a low-level (far below the 12-bit resolution of an > individual image) cross-talk between the four output channels of the > camera. The phenomenon is non-linear in that it does not appear until a > threshold luminance level is reached. Our initial hypothesis that there > were insufficient bypass capacitors associated with the video amp power > supply rails and CCD bias voltages appears to have been disproven by an > experiment involving the installation of larger caps. There appeared to be > no beneficial effect. > > Although not a serious problem, we would like to reduce or eliminate the > effect if possible. Before proceeding further with our testing, we thought > it might be wise to consult the CCD engineering community to see if anyone > else has seen such an effect and if they could indicate to us if it is due > to the CCD support electronics or an inherent property of this particular > CCD imager or multi-channel CCDs in general. > > Thank you very much for your attention. > > Best regards, > Roy Tucker > > - -- CCD-world -- -- > CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk > Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. > For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ -- _____________________________________________________________________________ Barry Michael Starr starr@cfht.hawaii.edu Canada France Hawaii Telescope Ph: 808-885-3139 PO BOX 1793 Kamuela, HI 96743 Fax: 808-885-7288 _____________________________________________________________________________ - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From naidu at iiap.ernet.in Thu Mar 23 10:48:13 2000 From: naidu at iiap.ernet.in (B.Nagaraja Naidu) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:42 2004 Subject: CCD-world: cross-talk in multi-channel CCDs In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.20000322093739.00e74cc0@orion> Message-ID: The following was posted to CCD-world: Dear Roy Tucker, If you are using same bias supplies for all four channels, you can try using different supplies for individual channels. Like for example, use separate VDD supplies for each channel, separate supplies for VRD and so forth. If not eliminated completely, it will at least reduce the cross-talk significantly. Naidu On Wed, 22 Mar 2000, Roy Tucker wrote: > The following was posted to CCD-world: > > Dear Fellow Photon-Foragers, > > I am participating in the up-grading of the GONG > (http://www.gong.noao.edu) video data system which includes a new camera > (Silicon Mountain Designs 1M60-20) with a Thomson THX7887A imager > (frontside 1024 square array, four channels of 1024 x 256, 14 um pixels, 60 > frames per second, 12 bits per pixel). Our data acquisition algorithm > consists generally of co-adding images for 60 seconds into three or six > accumulation buffers in synchrony with the angular orientation of rotating > optical elements in the system. Co-adding 600 or 1200 12-bit numbers > produces approximately 23-bit results. > > We are noticing a low-level (far below the 12-bit resolution of an > individual image) cross-talk between the four output channels of the > camera. The phenomenon is non-linear in that it does not appear until a > threshold luminance level is reached. Our initial hypothesis that there > were insufficient bypass capacitors associated with the video amp power > supply rails and CCD bias voltages appears to have been disproven by an > experiment involving the installation of larger caps. There appeared to be > no beneficial effect. > > Although not a serious problem, we would like to reduce or eliminate the > effect if possible. Before proceeding further with our testing, we thought > it might be wise to consult the CCD engineering community to see if anyone > else has seen such an effect and if they could indicate to us if it is due > to the CCD support electronics or an inherent property of this particular > CCD imager or multi-channel CCDs in general. > > Thank you very much for your attention. > > Best regards, > Roy Tucker > > > - -- CCD-world -- -- > CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk > Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. > For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ > - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From tucker at noao.edu Wed Mar 22 09:37:39 2000 From: tucker at noao.edu (Roy Tucker) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:42 2004 Subject: CCD-world: cross-talk in multi-channel CCDs Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20000322093739.00e74cc0@orion> The following was posted to CCD-world: Dear Fellow Photon-Foragers, I am participating in the up-grading of the GONG (http://www.gong.noao.edu) video data system which includes a new camera (Silicon Mountain Designs 1M60-20) with a Thomson THX7887A imager (frontside 1024 square array, four channels of 1024 x 256, 14 um pixels, 60 frames per second, 12 bits per pixel). Our data acquisition algorithm consists generally of co-adding images for 60 seconds into three or six accumulation buffers in synchrony with the angular orientation of rotating optical elements in the system. Co-adding 600 or 1200 12-bit numbers produces approximately 23-bit results. We are noticing a low-level (far below the 12-bit resolution of an individual image) cross-talk between the four output channels of the camera. The phenomenon is non-linear in that it does not appear until a threshold luminance level is reached. Our initial hypothesis that there were insufficient bypass capacitors associated with the video amp power supply rails and CCD bias voltages appears to have been disproven by an experiment involving the installation of larger caps. There appeared to be no beneficial effect. Although not a serious problem, we would like to reduce or eliminate the effect if possible. Before proceeding further with our testing, we thought it might be wise to consult the CCD engineering community to see if anyone else has seen such an effect and if they could indicate to us if it is due to the CCD support electronics or an inherent property of this particular CCD imager or multi-channel CCDs in general. Thank you very much for your attention. Best regards, Roy Tucker - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From P.Oates at rl.ac.uk Thu Mar 23 08:01:06 2000 From: P.Oates at rl.ac.uk (P.Oates@rl.ac.uk) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:42 2004 Subject: CCD-world: cross-talk in multi-channel CCDs Message-ID: <49F73BEED865D3119F8700902773C9F9099B6E@ZEXCHANGE09> The following was posted to CCD-world: Hi all Do you have a common Reset Drain to all 4 O/P Fets? One poossible cause. Are your electronics able to recover after the signal level indicated, so that the next pixel isnt sampled with the last ones remains??? Common. Well isolated OD, RD and OS... Any of this help PAddy e-mail:: P.Oates@rl.ac.uk | | We pass this way but once, there is no normal, there's no such thing as normal. | There's you and there's the rest, there's now and there's forever. | Do as you damned well please, have a look at Canberra, it will chill your soul. | That's what you could end up being, a pot-bellied, hairless, boring fa.. | ------------------------------------------------------------------/ -----Original Message----- From: Roy Tucker [mailto:tucker@noao.edu] Sent: 22 March 2000 16:38 To: ccd-world@astro.ku.dk Subject: CCD-world: cross-talk in multi-channel CCDs The following was posted to CCD-world: Dear Fellow Photon-Foragers, I am participating in the up-grading of the GONG (http://www.gong.noao.edu) video data system which includes a new camera (Silicon Mountain Designs 1M60-20) with a Thomson THX7887A imager (frontside 1024 square array, four channels of 1024 x 256, 14 um pixels, 60 frames per second, 12 bits per pixel). Our data acquisition algorithm consists generally of co-adding images for 60 seconds into three or six accumulation buffers in synchrony with the angular orientation of rotating optical elements in the system. Co-adding 600 or 1200 12-bit numbers produces approximately 23-bit results. We are noticing a low-level (far below the 12-bit resolution of an individual image) cross-talk between the four output channels of the camera. The phenomenon is non-linear in that it does not appear until a threshold luminance level is reached. Our initial hypothesis that there were insufficient bypass capacitors associated with the video amp power supply rails and CCD bias voltages appears to have been disproven by an experiment involving the installation of larger caps. There appeared to be no beneficial effect. Although not a serious problem, we would like to reduce or eliminate the effect if possible. Before proceeding further with our testing, we thought it might be wise to consult the CCD engineering community to see if anyone else has seen such an effect and if they could indicate to us if it is due to the CCD support electronics or an inherent property of this particular CCD imager or multi-channel CCDs in general. Thank you very much for your attention. Best regards, Roy Tucker - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From btruax at home.com Thu Mar 23 08:30:18 2000 From: btruax at home.com (Bruce Truax) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:42 2004 Subject: CCD-world: cross-talk in multi-channel CCDs Message-ID: <20000323132954.TPAE24587.mail.rdc1.ct.home.com@[24.2.165.185]> The following was posted to CCD-world: Roy, I was involved in a project using these cameras for another application, and while they are good in many ways, we had a similar problem. We never quite tracked down the source. In our application which was more of a gray scale imaging problem, we noticed distortion at the beginning of lines which appeared to depend on the intensity at the end of the previous line. We were using the camera for a heterodyne detection scheme so we were not sensitive to gain or bias differences but non linearity and signal mixing between channels were a problem. I think that the problem was greater than 1 bit in amplitude, but only because of the type of detection we were using. If we were taking astronomical images, we probably would not have seen the problem without multiple images. The project is still using these cameras, but we have realized that to improve the performance further, we will have to switch away from SMD. Bruce Truax >On 3/22/2000 11:37 AM, tucker@noao.edu said: > I am participating in the up-grading of the GONG >(http://www.gong.noao.edu) video data system which includes a new camera >(Silicon Mountain Designs 1M60-20) with a Thomson THX7887A imager >(frontside 1024 square array, four channels of 1024 x 256, 14 um pixels, 60 >frames per second, 12 bits per pixel). Our data acquisition algorithm >consists generally of co-adding images for 60 seconds into three or six >accumulation buffers in synchrony with the angular orientation of rotating >optical elements in the system. Co-adding 600 or 1200 12-bit numbers >produces approximately 23-bit results. > > We are noticing a low-level (far below the 12-bit resolution of an >individual image) cross-talk between the four output channels of the >camera. The phenomenon is non-linear in that it does not appear until a >threshold luminance level is reached. Our initial hypothesis that there >were insufficient bypass capacitors associated with the video amp power >supply rails and CCD bias voltages appears to have been disproven by an >experiment involving the installation of larger caps. There appeared to be >no beneficial effect. > > Although not a serious problem, we would like to reduce or eliminate the >effect if possible. Before proceeding further with our testing, we thought >it might be wise to consult the CCD engineering community to see if anyone >else has seen such an effect and if they could indicate to us if it is due >to the CCD support electronics or an inherent property of this particular >CCD imager or multi-channel CCDs in general. > > Thank you very much for your attention. > > Best regards, > Roy Tucker - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From droege at wwa.com Thu Mar 30 15:06:24 2000 From: droege at wwa.com (Tom Droege) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:42 2004 Subject: CCD-world: Fast ADC Message-ID: <3.0.32.20000330150622.00b0a390@pop.wwa.com> The following was posted to CCD-world: Those building high performance CCD systems might be interested in a fast 16 bit ADC. http://www.datapathsystems.com/index2.html I see under $50 for this 5 MS 16 bit device. Tom Droege - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From droege at wwa.com Thu Mar 23 07:35:15 2000 From: droege at wwa.com (Tom Droege) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:42 2004 Subject: CCD-world: cross-talk in multi-channel CCDs Message-ID: <3.0.32.20000323073513.0081be30@pop.wwa.com> The following was posted to CCD-world: Roy and CCD-world, There are about a million ways that you can get that level of cross talk. I have seen this level of cross talk from 1/4" of printed circuit trace in the wrong position. The first thing to do with a problem like this is to make a very careful diagram of where all the currents go. I find it is very hard to get people to do this. Often, if you study the circuit long enough and draw it with enough care the answer will pop out at you. I would concentrate on the output current path from the chip. Are there any common traces? i.e. the ground return from the pull down resistor on the CCD output. You might change this to a JFET that draws constant current so that big signals do not move the ground around. (Careful here, some of these devices are noisy.) The same holds for the later stages. No common current paths. Move the signals from place to place with differential drivers and receivers. Move local ground with the signal. Remember we are talking about 1/4" differences in printed circuit traces here. You do not quote your digitization rate, but I assume it is MHz rate or you would be using a 16 bit ADC. Lots of things can add problems at high frequencies. There are large peak currents that bounce the ground around. One needs very short leads between the driving amplifier and the ADC. I assume you are using surface mount devices. Really work on the layout to get the leads very short. However, the non-linear part gets me. Are you sure? Or is it just coming up out of the noise. Congratulations on what sounds like a very interesting system. Tom Droege At 09:37 AM 3/22/00 -0700, you wrote: >The following was posted to CCD-world: > >Dear Fellow Photon-Foragers, > > I am participating in the up-grading of the GONG >(http://www.gong.noao.edu) video data system which includes a new camera >(Silicon Mountain Designs 1M60-20) with a Thomson THX7887A imager >(frontside 1024 square array, four channels of 1024 x 256, 14 um pixels, 60 >frames per second, 12 bits per pixel). Our data acquisition algorithm >consists generally of co-adding images for 60 seconds into three or six >accumulation buffers in synchrony with the angular orientation of rotating >optical elements in the system. Co-adding 600 or 1200 12-bit numbers >produces approximately 23-bit results. > > We are noticing a low-level (far below the 12-bit resolution of an >individual image) cross-talk between the four output channels of the >camera. The phenomenon is non-linear in that it does not appear until a >threshold luminance level is reached. Our initial hypothesis that there >were insufficient bypass capacitors associated with the video amp power >supply rails and CCD bias voltages appears to have been disproven by an >experiment involving the installation of larger caps. There appeared to be >no beneficial effect. > > Although not a serious problem, we would like to reduce or eliminate the >effect if possible. Before proceeding further with our testing, we thought >it might be wise to consult the CCD engineering community to see if anyone >else has seen such an effect and if they could indicate to us if it is due >to the CCD support electronics or an inherent property of this particular >CCD imager or multi-channel CCDs in general. > > Thank you very much for your attention. > > Best regards, > Roy Tucker > > >- -- CCD-world -- -- >CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk >Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. >For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ > - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From droege at wwa.com Thu Mar 23 08:01:39 2000 From: droege at wwa.com (Tom Droege) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:43 2004 Subject: CCD-world: cross-talk in multi-channel CCDs Message-ID: <3.0.32.20000323080137.00793710@pop.wwa.com> The following was posted to CCD-world: Roy and all, First I will second Barry's recommendation. The Analog Devices technical notes on grounds are just great! Here is a suggestion on how to test. Remove the CCD. Apply a pulse generator to one of the outputs and run the system. You will probably have to kludge up something to generate the signal you need. But this is a tough problem and will require some preperattion. Now get a fast differential scope probe. Tektronix makes some nice ones. Now you can go around taking differences between grounds. With say a 1 volt pulse (or whatever the front end amplifiers will stand withoug saturation) and 100 uv or so sensitivity on the differential probe, you should be able to see a lot of stuff on the grounds. This just may lead you to a solution. Cross talk is a tough business at this level. Don't expect an easy solution. Don't hesitate to build up something to test properly. It is easy to spend a lot of time on little quick fixes that do not work when a more elaborate carefully executed plan will solve the problem. Errrr! Possibly you are using a multi-layer board with a common ground plane under the four channels. I would not do this. Four separate ground planes, connected at one point is the way I would go. Of course separate analog and digital ground planes with the digital plane separate from the analog plane. You can use one layer for both but separate them between analog and digital. I repeat my suggestion of making a good diagram. Every place there is a common tie between two grounds draw in an inductor. Put capacitors between everything on the diagram. Remember that the ground plane (if you have one, I would not) couples capacitively between everything. Sigh! A tough problem. Good luck with it and please keep us informed. It is often more important to learn how not to do things than how to do things. Tom Droege At 11:27 AM 3/22/00 -1000, you wrote: >The following was posted to CCD-world: > >Hi Roy, > >Photon-forager, I like that, maybe Photon-phorager or Foton-forager... > >Anyway back to the matter at hand... > >The first thing I'd ask is have you tested your acquisition system >performance separately from the CCD. If you still have the problem it's >not the device (or only the device at least at the level your currently >experiencing) if it goes away then either it's the CCD or your interface >to the CCD. Split the chain if you can to see what's your offending >party.... > >Regarding decoupling of video amplifiers, often the addition of more >capacitance does not improve your decoupling due to the resonant >frequency issues of non-ideal capacitors. Often you need to parallel >0.01uf ceramics with 1uF tantalums (surface mount best, extremely short >leads mandatory) to get solid wideband decoupling. There is a wonderful >application note by Analog Devices AN-202 "An IC Amplifier User's Guide >to Decoupling, Grounding and Making Things Go Right for a Change" by >Brokaw that's a classic (great title as well). But there's a load of >good info for Analog Devices, Burr-Brown, and Linear Technology >application notes in this area. > > >Good Luck, > >Barry > >Roy Tucker wrote: >> >> The following was posted to CCD-world: >> >> Dear Fellow Photon-Foragers, >> >> I am participating in the up-grading of the GONG >> (http://www.gong.noao.edu) video data system which includes a new camera >> (Silicon Mountain Designs 1M60-20) with a Thomson THX7887A imager >> (frontside 1024 square array, four channels of 1024 x 256, 14 um pixels, 60 >> frames per second, 12 bits per pixel). Our data acquisition algorithm >> consists generally of co-adding images for 60 seconds into three or six >> accumulation buffers in synchrony with the angular orientation of rotating >> optical elements in the system. Co-adding 600 or 1200 12-bit numbers >> produces approximately 23-bit results. >> >> We are noticing a low-level (far below the 12-bit resolution of an >> individual image) cross-talk between the four output channels of the >> camera. The phenomenon is non-linear in that it does not appear until a >> threshold luminance level is reached. Our initial hypothesis that there >> were insufficient bypass capacitors associated with the video amp power >> supply rails and CCD bias voltages appears to have been disproven by an >> experiment involving the installation of larger caps. There appeared to be >> no beneficial effect. >> >> Although not a serious problem, we would like to reduce or eliminate the >> effect if possible. Before proceeding further with our testing, we thought >> it might be wise to consult the CCD engineering community to see if anyone >> else has seen such an effect and if they could indicate to us if it is due >> to the CCD support electronics or an inherent property of this particular >> CCD imager or multi-channel CCDs in general. >> >> Thank you very much for your attention. >> >> Best regards, >> Roy Tucker >> >> - -- CCD-world -- -- >> CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk >> Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. >> For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ > >-- >_____________________________________________________________________________ > >Barry Michael Starr >starr@cfht.hawaii.edu >Canada France Hawaii Telescope Ph: 808-885-3139 >PO BOX 1793 Kamuela, HI 96743 Fax: >808-885-7288 >_____________________________________________________________________________ >- -- CCD-world -- -- >CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk >Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. >For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ > - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From MYPIXEL at aol.com Mon Apr 3 14:47:55 2000 From: MYPIXEL at aol.com (MYPIXEL@aol.com) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:43 2004 Subject: CCD-world: Fast ADC Message-ID: <3f.2dea76d.261a415b@aol.com> The following was posted to CCD-world: In a message dated 4/3/00 9:00:00 AM Pacific Daylight Time, droege@wwa.com writes: << The following was posted to CCD-world: Those building high performance CCD systems might be interested in a fast 16 bit ADC. http://www.datapathsystems.com/index2.html I see under $50 for this 5 MS 16 bit device. Tom Droege >> ************************jj Go back nearly 30 years and we had a very fast 16-bit ADC that worked at 8 usec /pixel ! It costs $560. . . used 5 watts of power in a 1 x 6 x 8 inch package. Amazing. ************************jj - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From skipper at siraeo.co.uk Mon Apr 10 12:27:49 2000 From: skipper at siraeo.co.uk (Skipper, Mark) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:43 2004 Subject: CCD-world: cross-talk in multi-channel CCDs Message-ID: <9D70BF372E81D2119C3900609769B49FDAB4@server1.sireo.co.uk> The following was posted to CCD-world: Roy and All In addition to Tom's suggestions you can generate a good CCD video signal by using the Readout register clock that trasfers the charge to the output, R2 on a two phase CCD. Link the clock to the output via a resistor divider and a AC coupling cap. A resistor from Vod to Vos will get the DC voltage correct. At the levels you are talking about the cross-talk could be optical due to stray light in the optical setup, so the elimination of the CCD is a good starting point. Regards Mark > -----Original Message----- > From: Hopkinson, Gordon > Sent: 03 April 2000 18:26 > To: Skipper, Mark > Subject: FW: CCD-world: cross-talk in multi-channel CCDs > > > > ---------- > From: Tom Droege[SMTP:droege@wwa.com] > Reply To: CCD-world@astro.ku.dk > Sent: 23 March 2000 15:01 > To: CCD-world@astro.ku.dk > Subject: Re: CCD-world: cross-talk in multi-channel CCDs > > The following was posted to CCD-world: > > Roy and all, > > First I will second Barry's recommendation. The Analog Devices technical > notes on grounds are just great! > > Here is a suggestion on how to test. Remove the CCD. Apply a pulse > generator to one of the outputs and run the system. You will probably > have > to kludge up something to generate the signal you need. But this is a > tough problem and will require some preperattion. Now get a fast > differential scope probe. Tektronix makes some nice ones. Now you can go > around taking differences between grounds. With say a 1 volt pulse (or > whatever the front end amplifiers will stand withoug saturation) and 100 > uv > or so sensitivity on the differential probe, you should be able to see a > lot of stuff on the grounds. This just may lead you to a solution. > Cross talk is a tough business at this level. Don't expect an easy > solution. Don't hesitate to build up something to test properly. It is > easy to spend a lot of time on little quick fixes that do not work when a > more elaborate carefully executed plan will solve the problem. > > Errrr! Possibly you are using a multi-layer board with a common ground > plane under the four channels. I would not do this. Four separate ground > planes, connected at one point is the way I would go. Of course separate > analog and digital ground planes with the digital plane separate from the > analog plane. You can use one layer for both but separate them between > analog and digital. > > I repeat my suggestion of making a good diagram. Every place there is a > common tie between two grounds draw in an inductor. Put capacitors > between > everything on the diagram. Remember that the ground plane (if you have > one, I would not) couples capacitively between everything. > > Sigh! A tough problem. Good luck with it and please keep us informed. > It > is often more important to learn how not to do things than how to do > things. > > Tom Droege > > At 11:27 AM 3/22/00 -1000, you wrote: > >The following was posted to CCD-world: > > > >Hi Roy, > > > >Photon-forager, I like that, maybe Photon-phorager or Foton-forager... > > > >Anyway back to the matter at hand... > > > >The first thing I'd ask is have you tested your acquisition system > >performance separately from the CCD. If you still have the problem it's > >not the device (or only the device at least at the level your currently > >experiencing) if it goes away then either it's the CCD or your interface > >to the CCD. Split the chain if you can to see what's your offending > >party.... > > > >Regarding decoupling of video amplifiers, often the addition of more > >capacitance does not improve your decoupling due to the resonant > >frequency issues of non-ideal capacitors. Often you need to parallel > >0.01uf ceramics with 1uF tantalums (surface mount best, extremely short > >leads mandatory) to get solid wideband decoupling. There is a wonderful > >application note by Analog Devices AN-202 "An IC Amplifier User's Guide > >to Decoupling, Grounding and Making Things Go Right for a Change" by > >Brokaw that's a classic (great title as well). But there's a load of > >good info for Analog Devices, Burr-Brown, and Linear Technology > >application notes in this area. > > > > > >Good Luck, > > > >Barry > > > >Roy Tucker wrote: > >> > >> The following was posted to CCD-world: > >> > >> Dear Fellow Photon-Foragers, > >> > >> I am participating in the up-grading of the GONG > >> (http://www.gong.noao.edu) video data system which includes a new > camera > >> (Silicon Mountain Designs 1M60-20) with a Thomson THX7887A imager > >> (frontside 1024 square array, four channels of 1024 x 256, 14 um > pixels, 60 > >> frames per second, 12 bits per pixel). Our data acquisition algorithm > >> consists generally of co-adding images for 60 seconds into three or six > >> accumulation buffers in synchrony with the angular orientation of > rotating > >> optical elements in the system. Co-adding 600 or 1200 12-bit numbers > >> produces approximately 23-bit results. > >> > >> We are noticing a low-level (far below the 12-bit resolution of > an > >> individual image) cross-talk between the four output channels of the > >> camera. The phenomenon is non-linear in that it does not appear until a > >> threshold luminance level is reached. Our initial hypothesis that there > >> were insufficient bypass capacitors associated with the video amp power > >> supply rails and CCD bias voltages appears to have been disproven by an > >> experiment involving the installation of larger caps. There appeared to > be > >> no beneficial effect. > >> > >> Although not a serious problem, we would like to reduce or > eliminate the > >> effect if possible. Before proceeding further with our testing, we > thought > >> it might be wise to consult the CCD engineering community to see if > anyone > >> else has seen such an effect and if they could indicate to us if it is > due > >> to the CCD support electronics or an inherent property of this > particular > >> CCD imager or multi-channel CCDs in general. > >> > >> Thank you very much for your attention. > >> > >> Best regards, > >> Roy Tucker > >> > >> - -- CCD-world -- -- > >> CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk > >> Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies > manually. > >> For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ > > > >-- > >_________________________________________________________________________ > ____ > > > >Barry Michael Starr > >starr@cfht.hawaii.edu > >Canada France Hawaii Telescope Ph: 808-885-3139 > >PO BOX 1793 Kamuela, HI 96743 Fax: > >808-885-7288 > >_________________________________________________________________________ > ____ > >- -- CCD-world -- -- > >CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk > >Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. > >For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ > > > - -- CCD-world -- -- > CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk > Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. > For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ > - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From roger at ctios1.ctio.noao.edu Wed Apr 19 18:43:27 2000 From: roger at ctios1.ctio.noao.edu (Roger Smith CTIO - rsmith@noao.edu) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:43 2004 Subject: CCD-world: LED with very stable light fux Message-ID: <200004192243.SAA22424@ctios1.ctio.noao.edu> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 3728 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.ctio.noao.edu/pipermail/ccd-world/attachments/20000419/35b28524/attachment.bat From naidu at iiap.ernet.in Thu Apr 20 09:52:08 2000 From: naidu at iiap.ernet.in (B.Nagaraja Naidu) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:43 2004 Subject: CCD-world: LED with very stable light fux In-Reply-To: <38FE055A.37121CDF@eso.org> Message-ID: The following was posted to CCD-world: Hello, Dorn, Roger Smith of CTIO, has described a compact stabilized pulsed LED source in his paper presented at a workshop on "Optical Detectors for Astronomy" at ESO, Garching in 1996. You may refer to the paper "How linear are typical CCDs" by Roger M Smith in the proceedings of this workshop. Regards naidu On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Reinhold Dorn wrote: > The following was posted to CCD-world: > > > Hello CCD-world, > > I am working on a new designed CCD for curvature wavefront > sensing, which measures the light at a location between the > the pupil plane and the image plane. In a real system, there > is a membrane oscillating at a fixed frequency around 2 kHz and > the CCD measures the photons collected during the intrafocal > and extrafocal periods. From these signals we than calculate the > normalized difference to be able reconstruct the wavefont tilts. > > To simulate the optical setup and to test the performance of > the CCD independently of the optical bench, I am locking for > very stable light source, preferred an LED. This LEDs should have > stable rise and fall times in the range of 0 to 5 microseconds and > a very stable flux for a certain amount of time (i.e. 240 microseconds). > Note that we try to move just a couple of electrons with the CCD and > therefore the LED flux should be extremely stable. > > The LED could then be driven by a clock pulse of the CCD controller > with and accuracy of 25 ns. > > > flux > | > | /----\ /----\ > |----/ \-- ----/ \------ time > > Does anyone know of a manufacturer or any source which is > producing an LED with those requirements. Any help is welcome. > > Best wishes from Garching, > > Reinhold Dorn > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > Reinhold Dorn e-mail: reinhold.dorn@eso.org > ESO-European Southern Observatory phone : +49-89-32006-547 > K.Schwarzschildstr.2,D-85748 Garching fax : +49-89-3202362 > http://www.eso.org/odt http://pc002863.hq.eso.org > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > - -- CCD-world -- -- > CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk > Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. > For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ > - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From ssutherl at gammametrics.com Wed Apr 19 16:20:18 2000 From: ssutherl at gammametrics.com (Sutherland, Scott) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:43 2004 Subject: CCD-world: Looking for CCD... Message-ID: <1583828ED67FD211A31D006008277B195DDEC6@MAIL> The following was posted to CCD-world: Hello all: I have an upcoming project and I am looking for a linear CCD with 5-10 um pixels, a 25-30 mm width, and a pixel height of at least 200 um. I need decent red and NIR sensitivity over the region 800-1050 nm (at least 5% at 1000 nm, preferably closer to 10). Back thinned, back illuminated would be even nicer. This is for a spectroscopic application, which is why I do not need an area CCD. If that is my only option, I can still use a subwindow and bin it. However, all the CCD's I can find that meet my needs are 1024 elements or so and all have 24-25 um pixel width. Most of the high pixel count linear arrays with small pixels have square pixels, so the height is very small. And these long, thin arrays do not have good IR sensitivity. Can anyone point me in the right direction? Thanks, Scott Sutherland Senior Scientist GAMMA-METRICS ssutherl@gammametrics.com - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From phil_hobbs at vnet.ibm.com Thu Apr 20 11:47:04 2000 From: phil_hobbs at vnet.ibm.com (Phil Hobbs) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:43 2004 Subject: CCD-world: LED with very stable light flux Message-ID: <38FF2678.74969520@vnet.ibm.com> The following was posted to CCD-world: I agree about using a LED, because as long as you don't let the die get hot, the spectrum of a LED is very constant over a wide range of drive levels. The best way to do this sort of job is with an integrating sphere and a feedback loop. Put a garden-variety indicator LED of the appropriate colour (green is probably a good choice) in one port of the sphere, covered by a white baffle, put a photodiode in a second port (no baffle needed), and take the output from a third port. Make sure that the total non-white area of the three ports is no more than 5% of the interior surface area of the sphere, and 2% is better. That 240 microsecond pulse is easily regulated with a photodiode in an op amp feedback loop, and the integrating sphere will ensure that (apart from photocurrent shot noise) the photocurrent is an exact replica of the output light pulse. Good luck, Phil Hobbs IBM T. J. Watson Research Center PO Box 218, Yorktown Heights NY 10598 Reinhold Dorn writes: > Hello CCD-world, > I am working on a new designed CCD for curvature wavefront > sensing, which measures the light at a location between the > the pupil plane and the image plane. In a real system, there > is a membrane oscillating at a fixed frequency around 2 kHz and > the CCD measures the photons collected during the intrafocal > and extrafocal periods. From these signals we than calculate the > normalized difference to be able reconstruct the wavefont tilts. > To simulate the optical setup and to test the performance of > the CCD independently of the optical bench, I am locking for > very stable light source, preferred an LED. This LEDs should have > stable rise and fall times in the range of 0 to 5 microseconds and > a very stable flux for a certain amount of time (i.e. 240 microseconds). > Note that we try to move just a couple of electrons with the CCD and > therefore the LED flux should be extremely stable. > The LED could then be driven by a clock pulse of the CCD controller > with and accuracy of 25 ns. > flux > | > | /----\ /----\ > |----/ \-- ----/ \------ time > Does anyone know of a manufacturer or any source which is > producing an LED with those requirements. Any help is welcome. > Best wishes from Garching, > Reinhold Dorn > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > Reinhold Dorn e-mail: reinhold.dorn@eso.org > ESO-European Southern Observatory phone : +49-89-32006-547 > K.Schwarzschildstr.2,D-85748 Garching fax : +49-89-3202362 > http://www.eso.org/odt http://pc002863.hq.eso.org > -------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From reinhold.dorn at eso.org Wed Apr 19 21:13:30 2000 From: reinhold.dorn at eso.org (Reinhold Dorn) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:43 2004 Subject: CCD-world: LED with very stable light fux Message-ID: <38FE055A.37121CDF@eso.org> The following was posted to CCD-world: Hello CCD-world, I am working on a new designed CCD for curvature wavefront sensing, which measures the light at a location between the the pupil plane and the image plane. In a real system, there is a membrane oscillating at a fixed frequency around 2 kHz and the CCD measures the photons collected during the intrafocal and extrafocal periods. From these signals we than calculate the normalized difference to be able reconstruct the wavefont tilts. To simulate the optical setup and to test the performance of the CCD independently of the optical bench, I am locking for very stable light source, preferred an LED. This LEDs should have stable rise and fall times in the range of 0 to 5 microseconds and a very stable flux for a certain amount of time (i.e. 240 microseconds). Note that we try to move just a couple of electrons with the CCD and therefore the LED flux should be extremely stable. The LED could then be driven by a clock pulse of the CCD controller with and accuracy of 25 ns. flux | | /----\ /----\ |----/ \-- ----/ \------ time Does anyone know of a manufacturer or any source which is producing an LED with those requirements. Any help is welcome. Best wishes from Garching, Reinhold Dorn -------------------------------------------------------------------- Reinhold Dorn e-mail: reinhold.dorn@eso.org ESO-European Southern Observatory phone : +49-89-32006-547 K.Schwarzschildstr.2,D-85748 Garching fax : +49-89-3202362 http://www.eso.org/odt http://pc002863.hq.eso.org -------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From droege at wwa.com Thu Apr 20 16:30:42 2000 From: droege at wwa.com (Tom Droege) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:43 2004 Subject: CCD-world: LED with very stable light fux Message-ID: <3.0.32.20000420163039.007d7380@pop.wwa.com> The following was posted to CCD-world: I have done some linearity tests on phototubes using a pulsed LED. I still have a graph on my Fermilab office wall showing 10E6 linear range. But it was done using neutral density filters, not good enough for this purpose. I was using the PM to test the electronics I built, not the other way round. I do not know the linearity possible, but other tests have indicated 1000-10000 to 1. I used an LED driven by an avalanche transistor and a short piece of cable. One can make 1-2 ns wide, very high amplitude pulses this way. Trigger the avalanche transistor so that it goes at the same amplitude. The cable makes sure the same energy is going into the LED on every pulse. The same thing can be done using the Tektronix mercury relay pulser (if you can find one). If the LED is driven with a 60 or 100 volt, 2 nanosecond pulse then most of the things that vary are not changing much with respect to 100 volts. The LEDs work just fine. You can put 1-5 amp pulses through them. Another trick is to temperature regulate the LED with a small TEC. Put the LED in a block of aluminum and regulate the block temperature. Of course feedback is a good idea. The feedback sensor described below by Roger could be used to regulate the HV supply to the cable. A few switches to gate the signal into the feedback loop and ... I could make a career out of doing this. ;^) Tom Droege At 06:43 PM 4/19/00 -0400, you wrote: >The following was posted to CCD-world: > >Hi Reinhold, > >I had a similar requirement when testing CCD linearity by measuring >signal as a function of exposure time with a pulsed LED. The >expereiment takes a long time if you can't generate fast stable >pulses. I was aiming for 0.05% accuracy of the integrated light in 1 >ms or greater pulse. > >I used an integrated photodiode-preamp from Burr Brown (OPT211) to >servo control the LED intensity. The photodiode/preamp has much >better temperature stability than the LED and is almost free from self >heating effects. The LED is quite temprature sensitive, and thus >varies in intensity depending on how long it has been on. > >One has to deliberately add some overshoot at turn-on to compensate for >the fact that the turn off time of the LED is very much faster than the >turn-on time for the servo controlled LED. To acheve this circuit >allowed adjustment of initial LED current. To find the correct setting >one compares the output from 1 long pulse with the output in single >CCD readout that integrates N pulses each 1/N th of the duration. > >The circuit is described in "How Linear are typical CCDs?", page 251 of >the proceedings of the ESO workshop Optical Detectors For Astronomy, >1996. I bet you have a copy. > >Roger > > > >> To: CCD-world >> CC: "Dorn, Reinhold" >> Subject: CCD-world: LED with very stable light fux >> >> The following was posted to CCD-world: >> >> >> Hello CCD-world, >> >> I am working on a new designed CCD for curvature wavefront >> sensing, which measures the light at a location between the >> the pupil plane and the image plane. In a real system, there >> is a membrane oscillating at a fixed frequency around 2 kHz and >> the CCD measures the photons collected during the intrafocal >> and extrafocal periods. From these signals we than calculate the >> normalized difference to be able reconstruct the wavefont tilts. >> >> To simulate the optical setup and to test the performance of >> the CCD independently of the optical bench, I am locking for >> very stable light source, preferred an LED. This LEDs should have >> stable rise and fall times in the range of 0 to 5 microseconds and >> a very stable flux for a certain amount of time (i.e. 240 microseconds). >> Note that we try to move just a couple of electrons with the CCD and >> therefore the LED flux should be extremely stable. >> >> The LED could then be driven by a clock pulse of the CCD controller >> with and accuracy of 25 ns. >> >> >> flux >> | >> | /----\ /----\ >> |----/ \-- ----/ \------ time >> >> Does anyone know of a manufacturer or any source which is >> producing an LED with those requirements. Any help is welcome. >> >> Best wishes from Garching, >> >> Reinhold Dorn >> >> -------------------------------------------------------------------- >> Reinhold Dorn e-mail: reinhold.dorn@eso.org >> ESO-European Southern Observatory phone : +49-89-32006-547 >> K.Schwarzschildstr.2,D-85748 Garching fax : +49-89-3202362 >> http://www.eso.org/odt http://pc002863.hq.eso.org >> -------------------------------------------------------------------- >> - -- CCD-world -- -- >> CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk >> Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. >> For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ >> >- -- CCD-world -- -- >CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk >Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. >For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ > - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From deg at mh1.lbl.gov Thu Apr 20 14:49:30 2000 From: deg at mh1.lbl.gov (Don Groom) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:43 2004 Subject: CCD-world: Red-sensitive CCDs with skinny pixels Message-ID: The following was posted to CCD-world: Dear Scott Sutherland, > I have an upcoming project and I am looking > for a linear CCD with 5-10 um pixels, a 25-30 mm > width, and a pixel height of at least 200 um. What do you mean by pixel height? a (5-10) x 200 um^2 pixel, or a depletion depth of 200 um? > I need decent red and NIR sensitivity over > the region 800-1050 nm (at least 5% at 1000 nm, > preferably closer to 10). You can have considerably better IR response with 200 um depletion--above 50% at 1000 um, for example. See our SPIE 3649, 80-90 (1999) paper on the QE of CCDs of various thicknesses. It's also on our web page ccd.lbl.gov > Back thinned, back illuminated would be even nicer. There are a lot of tradeoffs. To take advantage of small pixels, you need a small PSF contribution from lateral diffusion in the CCD. With a 200 um thick CCD depleted all the way to the back and with a high bias voltage, diffusion itself will contribute 6--8 um rms. If there is a field-free region, then it will probably dominate the PSF, contributing an rms width exactly equal to the field-free thickness. Back-illuminated thin CCDs usually show fringing in the red. For red and NIR I don't think it matters much if it is back illuminated, except that the IR coating can then be optimized. But if it is thinned to the usual 20 um the NIR reaches the numbers you target, and I know of no case in which the ff region does not contribute enough to the PSF that there is no point in 5 or even 10 um pixels. As far as I know the new SITe UV-B optimized CCDs beat the PSF problem (10 um thick) but lose on the QE. The Lincoln Labs high-resistivity chips (40 um sensitive region) significantly extend the red response, but I would expect a diffusion PSF contribution large enough that there is no point your small pixel width (Barry Burke can correct me.) Our developmental CCDs have a 300 um depleted region and no ff region, but also have a diffusion contribution of 6--8 um to the PSF, depending on the bias voltage. (See our ESO ODT 99 paper, also on the web page. Steve Holland has recently significantly extended this analysis, to be published.) --Don -|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|--|- Don Groom deg@lbl.gov (Particle Data Group, Supernova Cosmology Project) http://ccd.lbl.gov Voice: 510/486-6788 FAX: 510/486-4799 Analog: 50-6008//Berkeley Lab//Berkeley, CA 94720 - -- CCD-world -- -- CCD-world is fully moderated. Send posts to CCD-world@astro.ku.dk Standard replies will go to the list; address personal replies manually. For more information, please go to: http://www.not.iac.es/CCD-world/ From atwood at mps.ohio-state.edu Fri Apr 21 10:42:02 2000 From: atwood at mps.ohio-state.edu (Bruce Atwood) Date: Thu Jul 29 11:51:43 2004 Subject: CCD-world: LED with very stable light fux References: <3.0.32.20000420163039.007d7380@pop.wwa.com> Message-ID: <390068BA.AC179337@ohstpy.mps.ohio-state.edu> The following was posted to CCD-world: LED's are very well behaved devices if they are treated with care. (HP had and application note or article some years ago predicting 1% stability over 100 years for their hermetic parts.) Over current or static discharges can damage regions of the junction and permanently change their characteristics. For typical devices (T1 Red for example) operated at reasonable currents (10 ma) the -1%/degree C temperature coefficient (light vs temp at constant current) lets you operate at 1 percent linearity (total flux vs exposure time) for exposures over a range of 1 micro sec to 1 sec. I have used a constant current source and a 201HS switch with good luck for 20 (ouch) years. If you want to do better I would use the forward voltage of the device driven at constant current to sense the temperature of the device (about -1 mv/degree C). A four wire circuit would be required to get a good voltage reading with any reasonable cable length. From changes in the forward voltage generate a small correction to the current to compensate for changes in junction temperature. All in all a much easier task than closing the optical loop and can clearly be made to operate faster and with lower noise than an optical feed back system. If you must do the optical feed back trick at least use a more or less matched pair and close couple one of the sources to your detector to get a better signal level to work with. Tom Droege wrote: > > The following was posted to CCD-world: > > I have done some linearity tests on phototubes using a pulsed LED. I still > have a graph on my Fermilab office wall showing 10E6 linear range. But it > was done using neutral density filters, not good enough for this purpose. > I was using the PM to test the electronics I built, not the other way > round. I do not know the linearity possible, but other tests have > indicated 1000-10000 to 1. I used an LED driven by an avalanche transistor > and a short piece of cable. One can make 1-2 ns wide, very high amplitude > pulses this way. Trigger the avalanche transistor so that it goes at the > same amplitude. The cable makes sure the same energy is going into the LED > on every pulse. The same thing can be done using the Tektronix mercury > relay pulser (if you can find one). If the LED is driven with a 60 or 100 > volt, 2 nanosecond pulse then most of the things that vary are not changing > much with respect to 100 volts. The LEDs work just fine. You can put 1-5 > amp pulses through them. Another trick is to temperature regulate the LED > with a small TEC. Put the LED in a block of aluminum and regulate the > block temperature. > > Of course feedback is a good idea. The feedback sensor described below by > Roger could be used to regulate the HV supply to the cable. A few switches > to gate the signal into the feedback loop and ... I could make a career > out of doing this. ;^) > > Tom Droege > > At 06:43 PM 4/19/00 -0400, you wrote: > >The following was posted to CCD-world: > > > >Hi Reinhold, > > > >I had a similar requirement when testing CCD linearity by measuring > >signal as a function of exposure time with a pulsed LED. The > >expereiment takes a long time if you can't generate fast stable > >pulses. I was aiming for 0.05% accuracy of the integrated light in 1 > >ms or greater pulse. > > > >I used an integrated photodiode-preamp from Burr Brown (OPT211) to > >servo control the LED intensity. The photodiode/preamp has much > >better temperature stability than the LED and is almost free from self > >heating effects. The LED is quite temprature sensitive, and thus > >varies in intensity depending on how long it has been on. > > > >One has to deliberately add some overshoot at turn-on to compensate for > >the fact that the turn off time of the LED is very much faster than the > >turn-on time for the servo controlled LED. To acheve this circuit > >allowed adjustment of initial LED current. To find the correct setting > >one compares the output from 1 long pulse with the output in single > >CCD readout that integrates N pulses each 1/N th of the duration. > > > >The circuit is described in "How Linear are typical CCDs?", page 251 of > >the proceedings of the ESO workshop Optical Detectors For Astronomy, > >1996. I bet you have a copy. > > > >Roger > > > > > > > >> To: CCD-world > >> CC: "Dorn, Reinhold" > >> Subject: CCD-world: LED with very stable light fux > >> > >> The following was posted to CCD-world: > >> > >> > >> Hello CCD-world, > >> > >> I am working on